$25+2: Good move?

[Ugignadl]

PokerStars Game #15181012091: Tournament #76072723, $25.00+$2.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2008/02/09 - 20:56:56 (ET)
Table '76072723 58' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: Ugignadl (2785 in chips)
Seat 2: LohausFor3 (2190 in chips)
Seat 3: jaguardave (3243 in chips)
Seat 4: felena (1319 in chips)
Seat 5: shaun69uk (12240 in chips)
Seat 6: Crazysome (7710 in chips)
Seat 7: BunnieLee (4575 in chips)
Seat 8: Sk1pper (4085 in chips)
Seat 9: wutig22 (2615 in chips)
Ugignadl: posts small blind 50
LohausFor3: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Ugignadl [:3c: :3d:]
jaguardave: folds
felena: raises 400 to 500
shaun69uk: folds
Crazysome: folds
BunnieLee: folds
Sk1pper: folds
wutig22: folds
Ugignadl: calls 450
LohausFor3: folds
*** FLOP *** [:7c: :Kh: :2h:]
Ugignadl: bets 2285 and is all-in
felena: calls 819 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [7c Kh 2h] [:8h:]
*** RIVER *** [7c Kh 2h 8h] [:As:]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Ugignadl: shows [3c 3d] (a pair of Threes)
felena: shows [:Ad: :Jd:] (a pair of Aces)
felena collected 2738 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2738 | Rake 0
Board [7c Kh 2h 8h As]
Seat 1: Ugignadl (small blind) showed [3c 3d] and lost with a pair of Threes
Seat 2: LohausFor3 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: jaguardave folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: felena showed [Ad Jd] and won (273 with a pair of Aces
Seat 5: shaun69uk folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Crazysome folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: BunnieLee folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: Sk1pper folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: wutig22 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

[Terminal]

I tend to follow the "No set no bet" rule in that situation. You normally can't push someone out that already has that much of their stack in. 33 is just too vulnerable, IMO, so I just check it down or fold.

[Ugignadl]

You don't think Stop'n'Go is any good here?

I could have pushed preflop, but SnG is much less risky.

[Terminal]

Originally Posted by Ugignadl

You don't think Stop'n'Go is any good here?

I could have pushed preflop, but SnG is much less risky.

I think I would rather push preflop.

[Ugignadl]

Pushing 27BBs preflop with a 20+ BBs guy in the BB left to act when I can stop'n'go instead doesn't seem like a good idea...

[bigloser2448]

I dunno. I was thinking that maybe a "good" king would 4-bet pf, but prolly not since he'll be in position after the flop. I think his call on the flop was a little stupid, but obv. it paid off. :(

I think I agree with Term here though for what it's worth. I have a feeling your good on the flop, but too many cards with two to come can kill you.

I think if you posted this hand without the results, you may have gotten different response, IMHO.

[Ugignadl]

Really? I think people are still disagreeing about it being good even with the results there. Obviously here in this situation it is a good move, since donk will stack off without hitting a pair.

The only flop I don't push is A high with no 3. Since he misses the flop a good portion of the time, and holds pairs greater than three that don't set up a low portion of the time, I'm still not convinced it is a bad move in general.

[Terminal]

Originally Posted by Ugignadl

Really? I think people are still disagreeing about it being good even with the results there. Obviously here in this situation it is a good move, since donk will stack off without hitting a pair.

The only flop I don't push is A high with no 3. Since he misses the flop a good portion of the time, and holds pairs greater than three that don't set up a low portion of the time, I'm still not convinced it is a bad move in general.

If you have a good read that he is a total donk, then maybe. Donks can have hands as well. I am just saying you are probably getting called no matter what he had. I think even if you wait until the turn if another rag falls and then push you might be able to push him out, but still I doubt it.

Also I wasn't saying I would push 33 pre-flop, I was saying I would rather push it pre-flop than on that flop. I probably do what you did except for the flop all-in, I would just check. I also am not saying it is a bad play I am only saying what I would do. You obviously read the situation correctly and put it in with the best hand.

[Ugignadl]

But Term, isn't that exactly what we want? To be called by donky boy regardless of his holdings? Sure he has 6 outs but we are still good favourites to win the hand.

[bigloser2448]

LOL. Before even reading Ugi's reply, I knew he was going to say that. I think too many of us want the villain to fold even though we have the best hand at the time of the shove. It's a hard lesson to learn & I still haven't learned it. It's the best way to maximise your winnings when you get good hands,or even just a little better than the villain.